23. Trends in Sports Business Jobs from an OG Lou DePaoli, President General Sports and theClubhouse
About the Farrell Sports Business Podcast
Interviews with news makers from sports business to talk leadership, entrepreneurship, industry news and their unique career paths. Hosted by Matt Farrell, President of Farrell Sports and former Golf Channel, USOPC, USA Swimming and Warner Bros.
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Episode Summary
Episode 23 of the Farrell Sports Business podcast - Host Matt Farrell talks with Lou DePaoli who discusses his work at General Sports Worldwide and theClubhouse, focusing on career development in the sports industry, trends in the job market, the importance of culture and work-life balance, and the role of data analytics. He emphasizes the need for mentorship and the evolving landscape of sports careers, as well as the global expansion of their consulting services.
Farrell Sports Business (00:00)
Welcome to the Farrell Sports Business Podcast where I interview leaders in the sports industry. We talk about entrepreneurship, leadership, career development, mentorship. I'm the host, Matt Farrell.
On this week's show, we're going to talk to one of the absolute leaders in developing talent and creating opportunities for young people and people of all ages who want to get involved in working in the sports industry. My guest has one of those infectious personalities that just really gets you excited about leadership and working in sports. And he has a.
I've never met a stranger type personality also has the chops with C level and executive VP type level jobs in his past with the Mets, the Pirates the Hawks, the Marlins working at the NBA and now has a very successful worldwide consulting business. So this week's guest.
is with General Sports Worldwide and one of the founders of the clubhouse, which is a career development site for sports jobs, Lou DePaoli
Farrell Sports Business (01:28)
Lou can't thank you enough for joining the podcast. really appreciate it.
Lou DePaoli (01:31)
No, thanks for having me. I'm looking forward to our conversation.
Farrell Sports Business (01:35)
So even just talking offline, I can tell you and I both have a passion for sports and working in the sports industry. And so just can't wait to dive into it. But I'd like to give a little context. Can you talk about what you're doing now, general sports worldwide?
Lou DePaoli (01:44)
Yeah, same here.
Sure, sure. What my division does here at General Sports Worldwide is we focus on basically three major verticals. One of them being consulting, so working with organizations on how to improve their business and move it forward. Executive recruiting, so helping to place talent with our clients. People look at affiliate roles to help grow their business.
And then training, which we do a lot of leadership and sales training. Again, you see this common theme here, trying to move the business forward. and then the last piece that we have is the clubhouse, which I know you and I have talked about before, which is a career development platform for people in the earlier stages of their sports industry career, or those who are looking to get into it. We love advising and providing counsel on how to, how to get into the business, find some mentors and, and just provide general.
direction and try to help people out and pay it forward which I wish we had it 30 years ago when I was getting into the business.
Farrell Sports Business (02:49)
About the same timeline. the clubhouse, I think, is a really fascinating one to me because it, as you just described, it's not just a job board. There's some self -serve aspects to the site, but there's some white glove type services to the site that getting a job in sports is not easy. And so I really love the full service of it.
Lou DePaoli (02:53)
Yup.
Yeah, look, us too. it's interesting, you know, when we purchased the clubhouse about three years ago from a gentleman by the name of Bob Hamer, you know, Bob was a long time Phoenix Suns executive. He built this and put this model together and then eventually wound up moving on into a different out of the sports industry. And we bought it from Bob because we love the concept and we know Bob really well. We know what type of operator he was. And we just said, you know, if we could find ways to people to at first it was used to job
But at the end of the day what we started to realize it's a lot less about the job board and it's a lot more about the content and the connections. So you wind up having we have a hundred and sixty five mentors on the site as of right now who are willing to give back and talk to people and walk them through you know some coaching just picking their brains maybe offering them a job at some point but to build connections in the industry
And then we have a lot of universities now using the clubhouse for the content that we put up there. So our podcast videos are other videos that we put up there from training sessions, the blog posts that we do, the blog posts that the mentors put up there. It's all about an education in the sports industry. So it's a very interesting, not as many people. The job board is still popular, but it's not as high of importance as we thought it would be when we purchased it.
Yes, absolutely.
Farrell Sports Business (04:43)
So a little bit of a macro question, but as you see people trying to get into sports and sports related jobs, any trends you're seeing, is behavior different now than it was 10 years ago? What are you seeing?
Lou DePaoli (04:59)
Yeah, look, there's a lot more people trying to get into the sports world, which is great, you know, and look, front offices, league offices, the pool is expanding as well. So there's a lot more opportunity and jobs. But there's also, you know, a lot more people a little bit more reluctant to move. You know, I think in our careers early on, you know, Matt, we probably moved around. I know I moved every four or five years for another opportunity. You did the same. Now, when we talk to people, it's
You know what? really don't want to leave the market that I live in and I'm closer to home and I'm okay staying right in here if this can work. So that's one of the big things that sometimes can be a little difficult. You know when we're out there recruiting, you know, it's easy to recruit in New York, right? If people want to work in New York, you're from New York. There's 26 million people within, you know, an hour's ride of Manhattan. But when you're talking to other markets, maybe like a Charlotte or a Pittsburgh or a Kansas City, it's a little bit tougher to find someone who's in the
local marketplace or wants to live in those markets because there's less people willing to move. So that's one of the big things that I've seen is that it's really been and just really post the pandemic. People are a little bit more focused on staying home or not having to move if they don't have to, which is not a bad thing.
Farrell Sports Business (06:05)
Yeah.
So it's funny you mentioned that during my Olympic days. And as you may know, I'm based in Colorado Springs. I think one of the best cities on the planet, but it was a very polarizing city to recruit to. I mean, it's less than a million people and that's nothing against the city. It's if I don't like this job at USA swimming or the U S Olympic committee, what other sports jobs are there?
Lou DePaoli (06:33)
Yeah.
Farrell Sports Business (06:47)
And I'm moving to a half a million to 750 ,000 person market. It's hard. I was hard then it's got to be harder now.
Lou DePaoli (06:52)
Yeah. Yes, absolutely. But you know what? That just makes us work a little bit harder, get a little bit scrappier, right? And try to figure out how do we find those people who are willing or maybe there are some people in the marketplace who aren't currently in sport, but maybe have all the attributes in the background to be successful in sport. And maybe there's an opportunity for us to put them in front of a client and convince them why this person would be a great hire.
Farrell Sports Business (07:23)
This is at the risk of sounding like the grumpy old man sitting on my front porch. I'm 56. Most of my career finished college in the early 90s. So 90s and 2000s, early part of my career. It was a, there was no such thing as work -life balance. There was a, it was a pay your dues era. Is that?
changing at all? Do you still see some of that in the sports world?
Lou DePaoli (07:55)
Absolutely, know, absolutely, you know, it's not quite the same as it was, you know, back when we were both starting, you know, years ago, where, you're paid minimum wage, maybe you were locked in a room, you know, in a sub basement somewhere.
with a telephone and some lead cards, picking up the phone. It's advanced a little bit since then, which is good, but you still have to put in your dues. If you're looking to get an entry -level job in sports, you're not gonna walk in as the vice president of marketing.
You know, you're going to have to get your start off doing a bunch of internships, working your way up, maybe getting a full time job selling tickets or working in the marketing department or on social media and then just building your career and your network from there. But it's still the same, just the conditions are a lot nicer than they were when we were starting.
Farrell Sports Business (08:47)
That's free coffee now.
Lou DePaoli (08:50)
Yeah, have free coffee, free snacks for a lot of good organizations too. know, it's fun. Back then it was, you know, you got nothing, you were treated, you like just you guys stay out of the way, go in the dungeon and let us know when you've made some money for us, you know.
Farrell Sports Business (09:05)
So following you and all your, you know, your social accounts and, LinkedIn, there's a lot of inspirational stuff and, advice. and you talk about culture a lot. And so maybe we'll start broader and narrow this down, but sports jobs as a culture these days, where do you think the sports industry kind of has it right culturally?
Lou DePaoli (09:17)
Yeah.
Farrell Sports Business (09:35)
Are there areas where like, we're still missing the mark from a broad perspective?
Lou DePaoli (09:42)
Yeah, great question. And culture is one of my favorite topics. You know, it's one of the things that at all of my stops along the way, or even now for all my consulting opportunities and clients that we have, really try to focus it on culture. You know, want to build a culture where people can thrive, they can develop, you know, get an opportunity to contribute, be diverse. There's a lot of things that you could do to build the right culture that really have proven out over the years to drive your business forward.
You know, and I think one of the things, you know, for culture, you know, I think a lot more organizations realize you got to develop people.
Farrell Sports Business (10:19)
Mm -hmm.
Lou DePaoli (10:19)
You know, there's not a long line of people saying, yes, I want to work for your sports organization. And if you don't like it too bad, right. I mean, I'm the employer. I'm XYZ NBA team or XYZ MLB club or NFL club. Hey, if you don't want this job, someone else will take it. Right. I think they don't realize it. You need to invest in people that if you build a culture of development, get people in on the ground floor, educate them, motivate them, mentor them.
getting someone who's been there for three and four and five and six or seven years is a good thing because generally the work product gets better over time. The more time you're in a role and in an organization, the more impact you can have. That said, there's also a lot of opportunities. The culture has changed where like you and I, like we would change jobs every few years, right? Every five years, every six years I was onto something else. The younger generation is willing to do that in an even shorter timeframe.
Farrell Sports Business (11:19)
Yeah.
Lou DePaoli (11:19)
Right to say, hey, I've put in my two years here. I'm looking for my next opportunity.
We get those calls all the time. It's like, okay. Well two years is a little quick But you know if you're willing to move and you think you've got it and someone's willing to hire you we can help you But I definitely think the culture of the organizations have changed dramatically from hey, you're lucky to have a job here in sports to Hey, we're gonna build a nice culture here. We're gonna develop you and it's okay if you go work somewhere else down the road
You know, because this is a good sign for us that if people know your organization develops talent, it's a lot easier to attract more talent to come work for you. That was always our secret sauce for the organizations I worked for was that we built that culture and we made sure that everybody knew that if you worked for us, we would help develop you.
Farrell Sports Business (12:00)
It's a good way of looking at it.
Lou DePaoli (12:15)
That we would help promote you and then if that meant externally getting you another job somewhere else. We did it willingly Because then more talent came to us And I can't tell you how many times I just had a conversation with somebody who was on my team both in Pittsburgh and in New York with the Mets Saying, know, you remember how many teams would call us? To say hey, we need someone You know, who do you have? know you have the best trained people in the business Like who do you have?
And we'd like, sure, we'll willingly give up Matt. know, Matt has done great and there's no more room for him here. If this is a better opportunity, we'd be glad to help Matt work for you. So we became kind of like a first call for a lot of people before they reached out to the recruiters or posted to jobs online. Yeah.
Farrell Sports Business (13:02)
That's interesting. I mean, almost like going back to the relocation and a little bit of work from home culture to me meant going to the office and hallways and water cooler, so to speak. Culture means something different to other people. I, and I get that. Does it change how you consult or coach of building a culture when I'm making up a number?
30 % of the time that person's now on zoom versus down the hall. And what changes did we have to make to develop culture when just the personal dynamic changed?
Lou DePaoli (13:43)
Yeah, it's a great question. And it's obviously very, you know, topical given the last four years or four and a half years where, you know, we went from being in the office all the time to immediately not being in the office at all, to slowly being integrated back into a lot of organizations are flexible, where maybe they're in the office three or four days, you're home for one or two, depending on your role. And it's important to make sure that the people who are
maybe remote permanently. Or like my entire team, our entire organization is remote. So you have to make sure that you're staying in constant contact with people more than just, Hey, you know, do you have this report done or do you, how we make it out on this? It's like, how are you doing? What's going on? How's your family? You know, what have you been doing? Hey, how can we help just checking in? Like, did you have a good weekend? What did you do? That's amazing. Like making sure that you're continuing to build those types of relationships that you would have gotten in person.
You have to make that extra effort to do that either via phone or via video if you're not going to be seeing those people in person. And that's one of the things we talked to a lot of our clients about is, you know, when you're doing that and you have people on the road or if they're remote workers, you've got to find a way to make sure that they still feel part of the organization because if not, they could just as easily be sitting at home looking on LinkedIn looking for another job. And it's a lot easier to keep somebody than it is to try to hire somebody new.
Farrell Sports Business (15:11)
Well, it's great advice. You're a podcast guest as well as my own personal therapist right now. So this is really, really helping. So it's really some good advice.
Lou DePaoli (15:19)
Hahaha!
Glad we could help in any way,
Farrell Sports Business (15:28)
So one of the things, as you may or may not know or care, I have a TikTok account, that's about working, you know, jobs in sports and what it's like. And I answer a ton of questions and the stumper that it just always kind of hurts a little bit to me is somebody is worked in another profession 20 years and think sports is attractive, which I think it is.
And they've just done something teaching, selling life insurance, whatever it might be. And they say, I want to transition into the sports industry. That's always a tough one because there's a little bit of tough love that has to come with that answer. What's your perspective?
Lou DePaoli (16:17)
You know, I get that question a lot too. And it's actually a favorite topic of mine. Because as I tell people, yes, I've been in this business for over 30 years, but before I started in this business, I was in the insurance business. Right? I actually started my own brokerage when I was 24 years old. So I know what it's like to be in the outside business world wanting to work in sports.
and that I got my opportunity and I try to let people know that you the opportunities are there you have to look for them you have to network you have to explain why that if you're selling life insurance or insurance or if you're a teacher or whatever it may be what do you bring to the table other than I'm a big fan of your sports team because that's
That's not going to get it done. You know, I have instructed my clients and my staffs over the years. If somebody came to us and said, I'm a huge Mets fan. It's my lifelong dream to work for the Mets. Chances are they probably weren't going to get hired, to be honest. You we don't want to hire fans. You know, we're running at that point. It was a two point four billion dollar operation.
We can't afford to hire fans. You can be a fan of sport, you can be a fan of the business. And yes, if you bled a little bit of orange and blue for the Mets or black and gold for the Pirates, that's okay. But I never wanted someone's fandom to get in the way of their objectivity of doing their job.
And you know, that was kind of the big thing. So I have to walk people through that exact conversation of if you're doing it because you're a big fan of the Celtics and you want to work for the Celtics, that's probably not how you're going to get your foot in the door. You know, you really need to understand it's a business. What can I contribute to make this business better? Yes, I happen to be passionate about the sport, but here's how I can help improve the business. And most people go,
Okay, that's fine. I'm willing to do whatever. You know, I'll pick up the towels, know, I'll scrub the floors. Great. I they may be looking for those type of people, but that may not be overly fulfilling either. So, you know, just just try to make sure you figure out what it is that you want when you go for it and then go all in.
Farrell Sports Business (18:22)
You
Yeah, it probably does take a dose of, humility to kind of, step back and rework things. One of the more fun things, and I haven't done this a lot, but was with someone transitioning from the military. And now I say retired from the military that could be, you know, in their thirties, retired from the military. And it was always an interesting puzzle piece of.
Lou DePaoli (18:43)
Mm -hmm.
Correct. Yep.
Farrell Sports Business (18:55)
almost like taking all of the military language on their LinkedIn and their, you know, their resume and scrubbing it and just kind of saying, that's awesome experience. You did some phenomenal things. No one talks that way in the sports business. So no one knows what it means.
Lou DePaoli (19:08)
Right. Yes.
correct. Yeah, I'm a big fan of hiring people from the military and helping out people with military backgrounds because I think they bring such a level of, you know, work ethic, passion, desire, you know, they pay attention to detail because you have to.
You know, I just had this conversation with somebody yesterday. Literally, we talked about how do we get more military veterans in sport? And that's something that he and I are going to work on together. But he's ex -military. How do we figure that out? Because I've had really good success of hiring people from the military in my background.
And I see them being just really great employees and they bring a different, you know, a different level of thinking, a different level of execution to the table. Yes, maybe they haven't sold tickets or sponsorship or done marketing, but they've led teams in many cases into battle.
If they've actually seen actual service time, they've parachuted into foreign countries. It's just like, wow, stuff that makes your heart go, these guys put their life on the line. You know what? I think they'd be okay working in the marketing department. I think they'd be really good at helping me in my communications or helping me in sales. It's just...
We just have to figure out a way to kind of cross that bridge a little bit better So that we have a better landing spot for a lot of these, you know retired or current military People so we can get them better jobs
Farrell Sports Business (20:47)
I'm going to change gears just a little bit. I've had two previous podcasts guests that have really talked about one, an executive recruiter and one, a Dean at a university talking about really data analytics and data jobs really being booming and a growth industry in sports and checking out your bio. You were on the front lines of, some of this. Was that on the business side, the sport?
side, a little of both.
Lou DePaoli (21:20)
Business only. I guess some people call me an OG. An OG as it relates to data and analytics because I was doing things...
30 years ago, actually even go back to my insurance days. You know, I was using data and programming to help more strategically run our business. Right. And people at the time thought like, that's just crazy. Like, what are you doing? Does that really help? I'm like, yes. And that's been kind of the crux of everything that I've done in my career usually starts around understanding the data. And if, know, and then building a team around it who can actually drive the decision.
making. So building out, you know, reporting structures and using data to understand your fans, you know, understanding what decisions could be made so that you could be a lot more efficient and a lot more effective, you know, with your staff and your plans. So big fan, obviously, you know, I, I was the person who helped build out actually the NBA's data infrastructure and reporting tools that they use now. You know, I,
I did some of this stuff back in 2000 2001 when I started there and I know that the template of a couple of those reports that I built are still used. They're not.
you know, Excel files with tons of formulas, you know, it's now in Tableau and they have it all. It's all live and automated. It to be a little bit more manual on my end when I built it, but the actual formatting and how they use it is exactly the same. So big fan love data. and there's lots of opportunities still on the business and day and on sports side for people who really passionate about data to drive businesses forward or drive team performance forward.
Farrell Sports Business (23:14)
Is there, is there an early example that we would just take for granted now? Like, yeah, that's common to have this type of reporting that you created that was novel at the time. Can you, can you pull out an example or two?
Lou DePaoli (23:30)
Absolutely, so I'll go back to how far back do I want to go? let's go back to the NBA since I just mentioned the NBA You know they used to have Teams have to submit you know their financial data to the league office, so they had some NBA accounting Reporting that was done once a year you could get like a team's audited financials What they call the CFS combined financial statements? But there was really no good way for them. They were getting the game
game -by -game data, let's say on ticket sales.
And if people know what this is good for you. it was all being stored in an RTF file. So that's basically a word to file, right? It's a rich tech format. And I asked the NBA one day, do you have this information on a certain club or whatever? Like, it's here. It's, it's in this file. That's how we get it. I'm like, it's in a word. It's in an RTF file. Hmm. So I no, could you send me all of these? Sure. So that I scraped them all, put them into Excel and then start
putting them in alphabetically by team sorting them from high to low built -in macros that could literally just say okay here's who sold the most tickets high to low who's had the highest growth high to low who's got the highest revenue high to low right who sells the most group tickets who sells everything was just one macro and sorted it it was automatic nobody was doing that when I showed that to people it was like watching you know caveman seeing fire for the first time
Farrell Sports Business (25:01)
Yeah
Lou DePaoli (25:02)
right? And the funny thing is, Matt, you know, I built it more for my own consumption, right? So as a, in the early days of team bow, you know, myself, Bernie Mullen, who ran the department, you know, Dr. Bill Sutton and Scott O 'Neill and I, and some other senior executive, the NBA met with David Stern, you know, and we would sit down and go through, you know, what was going on in the league, what we saw when we were on the road, what are recommendations, what are things he needs to be aware of.
And one of the meetings I came with all my own data, right? From these reports. And I was like, well, this team is number two in the league in group sales and they've had a 22 % growth and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And everybody started looking at me. Where are you getting this data? So, Scott bill and Bernie said, let me see what you have there. And I showed them, was like, look, here's what I built. They're like, this is amazing. And then within two weeks, you know, we set it up so that it could be distributed every week to the NBA team presidents.
And they all said, this is a game changer. Like this is good for us to see where we stand because I can't wait till the end of the year to get an audited financial statement. I want to know, Hey, if the Denver nuggets did a great job with a group sale, I could know that and see their numbers change. And I could call out to my counterpart and say, Hey, what did you guys do? So was a little bit more real time on the data. and then obviously we would back it up with the best practices that help drive some of those numbers, but
Ranking from high to low. I mean really really inventive there, but Nobody was doing it. So I built it
Farrell Sports Business (26:32)
you
it's a great story. we've talked about the clubhouse a little bit. I want to also give you a chance. you have your own podcast, the sports business playbook. what's your, what's your
Lou DePaoli (26:45)
Yeah. Yeah.
Farrell Sports Business (26:51)
for lack of a better term, what's your angle with that and what type of topics do you like to hit and where can people find it?
Lou DePaoli (26:57)
Yeah, that's great. Look, Sports Business Playbook is something that we recently launched. You know, when we first started this division at General Sports, one of my partners here was Travis Apple. I don't know if you know Travis, but Travis had his own podcast at that time called 52 Weeks of Hustle.
Farrell Sports Business (27:12)
No.
Lou DePaoli (27:16)
And, you know, we just incorporated that into our general sports. So he did a podcast every week interviewing somebody from around the sports industry and obviously 52 weeks, right. And Travis is all about hustle. So people that were hustlers, people that got after it, talking about their careers. And when Travis left, he left a little over a year ago and went to one of our biggest clients, Logitech's, you know, based down in Boca in Florida. And we said, you know, we got to replace that with our own podcast.
We can't just let Travis go away with, you know, taking our podcast. So we kind of followed the same format, but try to keep it a little bit different if we could, you know, talking to some of our clients, talking to some of our friends in the business about topical, you know, subjects, you know, what's important. Like I think I know I know you've seen a couple of the ones that we've done. My first two was actually just one session. It was so much content we cut into two pieces with Dr. Bill Sutton.
know, Bill's a professor, been around for a long time, wrote the textbook that most students use in their school today. But it was also a teammate of mine at the NBA as a VP working in team bow. And we're just really close friends. It was easy to sit down and talk to a legend in the sports business.
And everybody knows doc bill right everybody knows doc Sutton It was just one of those fun to do right, but we try to keep it to 20 minutes half an hour of Content that we feel people will benefit from listening to and sometimes it's very focused on a topic. Sometimes it's just general But things that we feel people want to hear
Farrell Sports Business (28:56)
Anything about general sports worldwide, the clubhouse that I didn't ask you that I maybe should have. It's kind of the shameless plug opportunity here, Lou.
Lou DePaoli (29:08)
No, appreciate that I mean look the one thing is that here, you know general sports worldwide has been around No, general sports has been around a long time. You know our founder and CEO or chairman You know Andy Appleby started general sports back in the late 90s, you know after being a very successful senior leader with the Detroit Pistons and You know, Andy's been a serial sports entrepreneur so
about four years ago, five years ago, he decided to kind of rebrand it as General Sports Worldwide. And we're very big in Europe, you know, so most of our employees are actually based in the UK. Yeah, so and we're very big in soccer. So we do a lot of athlete representation. We do a lot of consulting over there on the business operations for soccer or football, as they call it. You know, we've got
Farrell Sports Business (29:44)
know that.
Lou DePaoli (29:59)
in our offices over there, have two former, you know, EPL club, you know, EFL club CEOs, right? So they know how to run a sports franchise over there. They understand the soccer business and they're doing gangbusters. And, know, we're slowly trying to merge, the North American approach, the European approach, and then taking it more global. And we're starting to see a lot of great success. I think that's something that a lot of people know us in the North America for what we've done over the last
few years of what Andy has brought to the table. But really, we are in the process of expanding our footprint globally. And we're in the process of actually opening up a third office in Saudi Arabia and Riyadh. So just trying to make sure the world's a big place. And there's lots of opportunity for people like us to be able to share our knowledge into some of these areas where maybe they could use some help on the business side consulting, or maybe we could pick their brain on some other areas.
So just lots of a shameless plug for general sports worldwide, which could be found at general sports worldwide dot com. And for the clubhouse again, for the early stage people in their career looking for mentorship and looking for content, you know, that's the clubhouse careers dot com.
Farrell Sports Business (31:17)
You took my last question. So that is so perfect. And we both, it's been fun getting to know you recently and share a passion for paying it forward. As you say, whether on podcasts or, or silly tech talks or whatever it might be, but, your advice and counsel is, is gold. so Lou, thanks so much for joining the podcast and providing your insight. I greatly appreciate it.
Lou DePaoli (31:19)
you
Yeah.
No, my pleasure. Thanks for having me.
Farrell Sports Business (31:49)
I just love Lou's energy and passion for working in the sports business. Lou has taken a lot of notes. So thank you. So August and September have been, months where we do focus a lot on career development and sports. There are a few other topics from recent podcasts, from an executive recruiter of what his light.
Life is like in sports, Jeff Yocom Steve Dittmore is a Dean at the university in North Florida talking about education, working in sports. And, there's my most recent, podcast has some FAQs about how to get a job and search in the sports industry. So follow along and please give this a five star review. If you're on YouTube, hit subscribe.
And you can find a little bit less info by following me on TikTok, where I answer questions about working in sports as well. And that's Matt Ferrell underscore. In meantime, thanks for listening to the Ferrell Sports Business Podcast.
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