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30. Breaking into the Sports Business with Beth Hendler-Grunt, Career Expert & President, Next Great Step



30. Breaking into the Sports Business with Beth Hendler-Grunt, Career Expert & President, Next Great Step


About the Farrell Sports Business Podcast

Interviews with news makers from sports business to talk leadership, entrepreneurship, industry news and their unique career paths. Hosted by Matt Farrell, President of Farrell Sports and former Golf Channel, USOPC, USA Swimming and Warner Bros.


Watch it on YouTube - www.youtube.com/@farrellsportsww


Listen in Podcasty Places - Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeart Radio and more



Summary

Episode 30 - In this episode of the Farrell Sports Business podcast, the host Matt Farrell talks with Beth Hendler-Grunt, the founder and CEO of Next Great Step. She discusses her journey in helping college students and recent graduates secure internships and jobs. She shares insights on the challenges faced by young adults in the current job market, the importance of skill development, and the unique approach her organization takes to empower young adults. The conversation also touches on the evolving role of parents in career development, the significance of networking, and the impact of social media platforms like TikTok in reaching and guiding young adults.


About Next Great Step

Complimentary intro consultation for parents, students or both.


Free resources – Resume, LinkedIn, Interview Prep, Chapter 1 of Beth's book:


Get the #1 Best Selling book, The Next Great Step:


Follow Next Great Step on Social

Facebook / nextgreatstep

LinkedIn / bethhendlergrunt

Instagram / next_great_step

TikTok / next_great_step

YouTube / @nextgreatstep


Farrell Sports Business (00:00)

Welcome to the Farrell Sports Business Podcast where I interview leaders in the sports industry about their jobs, trends in their industry, and about their own personal career path. I'm the host, Matt Farrell.


In past episodes, we've talked about getting jobs at the Superbowl and a lot of times talking about executive recruiter and director and VP level jobs. We're going to go to the other side this time and talk about what it's like entering the sports business market as a recent grad or even a student and what services are out there to help people early on in their career path.


chasing the dream of looking for a job in sports.


It's stressful, it's high anxiety, and both students and their parents are looking for what's next.


This week's episode is a really insightful conversation with the CEO and president of a company that is actually designed to help students and recent grads find their next job. We're obviously going to have a little bit of a spin on the sports industry with it. But it's a white glove type treatment. She's an author. She's a speaker. And she's the president of Next Great Step, Beth Hendler-Grunt


Farrell Sports Business (01:34)

Well, we've got so many things we, we, we met on tick tock, which we're absolutely going to get into. cause I just love talking about tick tock, but how about a little bit of background of next great step.


Beth Hendler Grunt (01:50)

Absolutely. So I am the founder and CEO of Next Great Step and our sole focus is to help college students and recent grads land that internship for that first job after college. And I launched it 10 years ago.


And it came about really because I had seen, was working with actually in the consulting world, helping lots of executives be successful in creating a strategy and compete. And they would always say to me, you know, I'd love to hire someone who just came out of school, but I'm going to pass on that because I don't have time to babysit. They don't understand our challenges and I need someone with more experience. And I also became of the age where I had lots of friends with kids saying, I don't get it. My kid went to a great school. They have great internships.


and they cannot get the job. And I literally started in my basement with a lot of my friends' kids, teaching them more of a strategy about how to navigate the process. And they all said, hey, you know what? I'm not getting this at school, or this is really helping me. And that's kind of how it started. And now we're 10 years in, and we've worked with thousands of young adults to help them launch. And I'm really proud of that. Over 80 to 90 % of them actually get the job that they want.


Farrell Sports Business (03:06)

I want to come back to that number as well, but, you know, personal experience about four years ago was during the pandemic. I, I thought I wanted to start my own business and you're going to go through this wishy washy period. And, and then there's always a tipping point of when you make the leap of like, yeah, this is going to work. Let's go. What was that for you? Or was there a moment like that?


Beth Hendler Grunt (03:08)

Ha ha.


Yeah.


Bye bye!


Yeah, you know, it's funny and this is more of like being someone who's an entrepreneur and a startup. So I'd always worked for big companies prior and then I worked for a more boutique consulting firm and then out on my own as an entrepreneur. I was working at this probably for almost a year until I got my first client. So one of the tipping points, people say, what are you doing? What are you doing? Why are you not, you know, I had, was the vice president and director and different big companies and it was only when I finally got that first client, maybe that was my tipping point.


of like, all right, we can do this. There's something here. And then when it just started to take off, you know, one person would tell another or just the fact that the kids kept getting jobs. And I am not a career coach by trade. I'm not a recruiter by trade, but I do know how to coach others. I also know how to sell and I know how to teach others how to sell themselves. And I think once I started seeing all that success and that they were having success in doing it, I'm like, wow, we actually we got we got something.


here and there's a need. There's a huge, that's also in terms of as an entrepreneur you're always looking what's the problem that you can solve and this is a huge problem and I will say


It was always a big problem pre-pandemic, but post-pandemic, I feel terrible. mean, our kids were significantly impacted. They missed so much of a typical experience of even just talking to people, being in front of somebody face to face, just learning how to forge a relationship and communicate in a way that expresses value. It's even more critical now. So we've seen a huge jump in the need for


our business and our services because we're really helping kids not only figure out their path, but just helping them feel confident and helping them feel like they have a direction because the pandemic really messed up a lot of people.


Farrell Sports Business (05:25)

Absolutely. A lot of change in my life and my family and so I totally get it and relate. So, but your corporate background or consulting background, what were some of the building blocks along the way that that just fell into place that you said, yeah, this is the right time for this business for for me and for next great step.


Beth Hendler Grunt (05:45)

Yeah, mean, Anna, you know, I think I had already put in about 20, 15 years in like corporate, you know, companies like AT &T and Lucent Technologies and Avaya. And then I was with a consulting firm for about another 10 years and I was just ready to not work for somebody else. I was ready to not be on someone else's demands or timeframe. Although, of course, I'm probably working more hours now and putting, you know, there's no...


Farrell Sports Business (06:14)

I get it.


Beth Hendler Grunt (06:14)

You don't know when the day ends, I keep going, right? But I do feel that I was just ready to be accountable to myself and also challenge myself to see if I could do it.


So that was kind of the number, that was really the main shift. And I saw that there was this huge problem and there weren't a lot, there still aren't a lot of people solving for it. I tried a lot of, excuse me, I tried a lot of different ways too. By the way, you have to fail a lot before you get something that works. And I thought initially, I'm like, I'm going to go to all the universities and help supplement their career services, or they're going to hire me to help them, know, better create a structure for their program.


And the truth is that a lot of universities are not interested. Career services is not a revenue generating function in a lot of schools. It's also not required for accreditation to graduate. So when you have a combination of people think either they have it under control or they don't care if it's not that great because sometimes a lot of schools just think their goal is to educate is not to get a job. Now, yes, you're hearing more ships about that, but there's some very much in


grain philosophy in education and university settings about how to move forward. And I probably spoke and presented at almost every school in New Jersey, which is where I'm from, some New York schools, but they also don't really want to pay you for it either. They just think they have it under control. And I saw what was happening even in the tutoring market where parents pay a lot of money or just for SAT, ACT, college advising. said, you know what? I think people not


only need help getting in to school, they need help getting out. And that I really just started targeting parents and families and that's you know what has really worked for us.


Farrell Sports Business (08:06)

That's a great way to say it. You know, you think about getting in and how do you get out? you know, there's a lot of your materials that, you know, I, come from, you know, a marketing side and slant of life. I, so I read your materials, I read your posts on LinkedIn and they seem very intentional. And I mean, this very, very positively of kind of what you are next great step. And in some cases, what you aren't, it's not a one hour.


consultation, I would almost consider it little white glove type service, but how would you describe what next great step is?


Beth Hendler Grunt (08:40)

Yes, yes.


Yeah.


Great question. And it's so funny, it's evolved, right? Even as someone who started this business, I kind of thought it was going to be one way. But what we are is we really do two things. We help young adults figure out what skills they have that they can bring to the market. And then once they figure that out, we help them determine, who do you want to bring those skills to? And how do you articulate your value in doing that? So you actually get to pick. It's not about just


what's on a job board. And I think as part of that, we're helping young adults feel confident in this process. And we're taking a process that's very overwhelming, unstructured, right? Kids were in a structure from kindergarten through end of college for 16 years with a syllabus. And now all of a sudden you're thrown into this job market and it's like, you don't know where to start first. And they think it's one way or another and.


we are doing is giving a really simple, structured, step-by-step approach that helps young adults not only figure out what they want to be doing, but how to be the one chosen, and we're all outcome-focused. So that's why we determined you can't hire us for one hour, because I can't teach a young adult what they need to know in one hour. It's over a couple of months, maybe two to three months. We started with six sessions, and then we went to eight, and now we're realizing


might need 12, but I'm all about the outcome because if you just, I feel like it's just like poking the elephant. You can take an hour with someone or get your resume fixed. That's great.


but that doesn't give your entire brand and you as a marketing person understand this. You need to create this brand for yourself and you need to represent and show that in every way you communicate through your cover letter, your follow-up letter, your resume, your LinkedIn, what you say in the interview. You need to be really consistent in how you share the skills that you have to offer. And I think that's what we're helping our young adults do, which is why it's a program. And you know, it's just like another class that you


take the college, just we're not grading you, but we're here to really guide you through the process.


Farrell Sports Business (11:00)

So I want to come back to that 80 to 90 % success rate number because I find that phenomenal. mainly because, you're probably getting clients with a range of ability levels. and to have that type of a success rate, what does that look like? And what does that mean? It was like, I want an internship with the New York Mets.


Beth Hendler Grunt (11:25)

Yep. Right. So, yeah.


Farrell Sports Business (11:25)

Or I want an internship in baseball. Those are two very, very different things. So how do you, how do you achieve that? Cause it's really impressive.


Beth Hendler Grunt (11:32)

Yeah, and so fun, that's why I enjoy talking to you and following your videos because I had a nickel for every kid who comes to me and says, I really want to work in sports because I love sports. I'm like, well, that's great, but loving sports does not get you a job in sports. I think what so often people see like the shiny object, right? You see, this looks amazing or on social media. And what we say is kind of like,


Take a step back, even forget what your parents told you to do or what your friends are doing. What we are really honing in with our young adults is let's focus on what are the skills that you have? What are the talents? Now, a lot of young adults say, I don't know, I didn't do anything or I only went to class. What do you do? You do, right? Either you're great at, are you in a group project? Are you the leader?


or you may be the one operationalizing or organizing everyone. There's some kind of role that you gravitate to that you know that you're good at and you've done that. And I think that's one of the first pieces as we help pull that out. Because once we can help a young adult figure out not only what skills you have, but what's the story behind it. So if you tell me you are a great writer, awesome, everybody writes papers, but I need an example of that. Well, maybe you wrote for the school newspaper three times a week.


Maybe you're great at interviewing people and synthesizing a large volume of information and bringing it, make it concise. So when they start to understand how they actually have something to offer and the skill and a story to back it up, all of a sudden we say, well, let's think about what are those companies or organizations that need those skills? So long ways saying, if you want to work for Major League Baseball, maybe you want to be a writer. Maybe you want to be a sports writer. Maybe you need to understand


What does it take to be in the writing field? You weren't thinking of that, you were just thinking, we want it to be more specific. And I think that's what we help them do is figure out what are your talents and how do you line that up with what an organization needs? And what I'm always teaching them too is by the way, sports is a business. And as much as you love watching it and go into it, they're all about making money. And what can you do to help them, sports, any team?


make money. And by the way, same goes for entertainment. Same goes for film, music, even though it seems very, you don't always think of that, but everything has an objective or a goal, right? It's either money and gain more clients, know, improve customer service, sell more tickets, whatever it is. And we're trying to have them think big of how can you take your skills and really line them up with what that organization needs to help them be successful. And that's what makes somebody want to hire you.


not your love of sports.


Farrell Sports Business (14:21)

I knew we were going to be fast friends. What she said. So in that same vein, when you're doing working with a student or a recent grad, and I say this of all, we all have strength and weaknesses. There has to be a little bit of a tough love aspect to some of this of calling out where I'm weaker and say, Matt, we need to work on this area.


how do you do that? Cause some people are receptive to that type of constructive feedback and some are, how do you go about it?


Beth Hendler Grunt (14:56)

Yeah, good question. I a lot of that starts with our vetting process before we even take a client on because very often, know, Kim and I have two clients. I have parents who are worried, stressed and overwhelmed that their kid is going to be on their payroll forever. And who usually, you know, start the process saying, can you help my kid? Because they don't want to listen to me. By the way, I get it. I have two kids that are 22, 25, both seen in their last year.


undergrad and grad school. So I get it. It doesn't matter if mom is the expert. They don't always want to listen to me. And then we need to think about also, do they want this? Right? You know, I tell every student, don't come work with us or don't work with any coach or anything. Don't do this. If you think you got it figured out or you don't want, you're not, you haven't suffered enough pain, right? If you feel like you still want to go see what it's like to apply to like a hundred or 200 jobs and wait on that. Great. Like go for it.


but don't come to us if you feel like you got it all figured out. And a lot of that's part of the vetting process. even though, yes, we still have students who come to us and say, well, I really want this. And we press them, say, okay, well, what are you doing to, what's your background? What did you study? Or what have you done to develop skills? And we're not saying it's impossible, but I think the part that helps them, I don't even have to say it to them. What we're doing is we're teaching them how to strategically network.


with people who have the job that they want. Doesn't have to be the vice president, could be someone, my favorite people for students to network with is someone who went to the same school as you and had the same major, and you can figure that out easily on LinkedIn, and talk to this person, have a 10 minute conversation. How did you get there? What did you need to do? What are the main skills that you're using now? And you're gonna learn very quickly.


whether you like what they have to say, right? Everyone says, I wanna work for like the NBA. I mean, have other people that, you know, it's a grind. Any kind of sport, like it can be a grind, right? You've taught, in your videos, you're traveling, you don't have control. You may not get paid a lot of money, you might start in ticket sales. You gotta figure out by talking to real people, not in your head and not just looking at social media and not looking at, you have to have conversations with people who are doing the job that you're thinking about. And that starts to help young adults get clarity.


Farrell Sports Business (16:53)

You


Beth Hendler Grunt (17:13)

because you're like, wow, I like what they had to say, I wanna learn more or oof, that's not what I thought it was gonna be. And maybe that's not the direction I wanna head in. So I'm not telling them, I'm just helping facilitate the process of how they can get smarter about the, what they might wanna do and then we make decisions together as opposed to, I never will say go do this, that's not our job. Our job is to give you the tools to help you figure it out.


Farrell Sports Business (17:41)

So you mentioned parents as well, and I'm fascinated by this because even on my TikTok, I find a lot of parents following. so how or has the role of parents changed with students and recent grads now compared to five years ago, 10 years ago, or whatever?


Beth Hendler Grunt (17:51)

Yes.


a good question. And I am one of these parents, by the way, you know, I have kids this age. I think a couple things have happened. you know, look, parents have always been interested, concerned, wanting to help. But we've also had a major shift in the job market. So we went from a pretty strong job market and let's say 2018, 2019, we had the pandemic where things like kind of flattened a little bit and then it went nuts. know, in 2021 and 2022, there were two jobs for every


applicant. Think about that. So you have two jobs to pick from for every applicant. There are like 8 million open jobs and or 10 million open jobs and 8 million job seekers, something like that. But now just I'll say specific to 2024, there is one job for two applicants, right? So you're now really competing. The job market has gotten so much tighter. I think it's just mostly right sizing itself back to where it was in 2019. So that


big growth and tech and other consulting other places. It's just coming back down. And I'll just say specific to this year, last year or two, it is competitive. It is very competitive. And I think, and it's also very expensive for a young adult to be able to even be independently financially stable on their own. So moving to an apartment or in a big city. So parents,


understandably, again, I'll speak for my, are worried. Like not only are there fewer jobs, it's more competitive, it's more expensive to live independently. And yeah, they're worried. I mean, they're worried about, you know, am I delaying my own retirement to support my kid? mean, there's a lot of kids, even post pandemics, that are still living at home because they just can't afford to move out. So we have all these economic factors. have,


Also kids who significantly impacted by mental health. mean, over 30 to 40 % of young adults now have a diagnosable anxiety or depression. And we cannot overlook that. have this, so we have all these factors of a tough economy, tough mental health, tough job market. And yeah, parents are, they're like, this is not what it was when they graduated college. I'll speak for myself. It was not like what it was when I graduated college. And...


I do see that worry. Sometimes it's a little bit too intense. Everybody needs to take a breath, but yeah, everybody's kind of concerned right now.


Farrell Sports Business (20:42)

Yeah, my wife and I were having the same, a similar conversation. And this is a topic for another day, but you know, my, my daughters are 25 and 21. And just think for a second what the people of that age have lived through. mean, the early side, early side of 9-11 and school shootings and the most hateful political environment ever. then pandemic.


Beth Hendler Grunt (20:49)

Yeah.


you


Farrell Sports Business (21:11)

and you kind of step back and you're like, wow, that they're dealing with a lot.


Beth Hendler Grunt (21:17)

It's heavy. We literally have the same conversation too. I didn't have that same feeling. First of all, there was no social media. There was no phones. mean, there's a blissful ignorance that we got to experience, I'll say, in our age group that we didn't even know what was going on, per se. But yeah, I feel for young adults. It's definitely a very heavy timeframe. There's a lot weighing on them for a lot of different angles.


Farrell Sports Business (21:25)

Yeah.


Yeah. Well, I want to transition on, you know, the search process itself. And I think there's something where you and I have had similar content on this. But it's this notion of I've gone to job site, I've hit, I've hit submit. I'm done. And this false sense of progress.


Beth Hendler Grunt (22:08)

Yeah.


Yes, yes.


Farrell Sports Business (22:14)

What's your take on that and what do you talk to students about?


Beth Hendler Grunt (22:18)

Yeah, yeah. look, we keep in mind, so we have this demographic that grew up with a device in their hand. And this device, the phone, you know, gives you a lot of things instantly, right? There's this expectation that things will happen quickly. And if I just use the technology, so the same thing, when you're on LinkedIn and it says, easy apply, or indeed, or Glassdoor pick your site,


It looks very easy, like, great, I'm gonna fill out the application once and I'm gonna submit it 100 or 200 times. But that is not the metric that young adults should be measuring and that's the problem. They're falling down under this false pretense that one, that more is better, more is not better. And that two, they think if I just have the right keywords or I just meet the algorithm where it is, it's gonna find me.


It's gonna find me and that person's gonna find me for that perfect job and I'm just gonna sit back and wait and I'm gonna have to fight off all the job offers. And that is not the case. That's not the case. The technology is misleading. And what I tell my clients, I said, you're measuring the wrong thing. You should not be measuring how many jobs you're applying to. I'm kind of in that mode of like, I barely want you to apply. I want you to measure.


how many people are you talking to that are doing the job that you want or are in the company that you aspire to get into? It has nothing to do if there's a job posting or not. If you're telling me that you want to work in data analytics for the NBA and there's no postings right now, you need to go through your, start with your alumni. I feel like that's the easiest. People are most friendly. You went to the same school.


See who went to your school and maybe works there. And by the way, and if not, find someone who graduated in the last three to five years who's doing a data analytic role at the NBA. And look on LinkedIn, it's the biggest free database you can access. Doesn't matter whether you went to the same school, you reach out to them saying, I'm really impressed with the role that you're taking on there. I'd love to learn more about it. I appreciate connecting. You just gotta get them to connect and then get their email.


And then, would you be willing to spend 10, 15 minutes with me so I can just learn a little bit more? I appreciate it. Just that reaching out, showing that you've read their profile, you've taken interest, you're not just some, you're not spamming them with a random message. And when you have these conversations, we actually teach them, there's a framework that we teach called the three A's, and I'll tell you briefly, the three A's before you have a meeting with everyone is the first A is action.


If the meeting goes exactly as you want, what do you want that person to do on your behalf that'll push you further in the process? And if they're gonna take an action, what's the attitude you want them to have about you? What do you want them to believe about you? These are the skills that you have. And lastly, what are the answers you need? Meaning what questions do you wanna ask that you can't find the answer to on the internet that only this person could answer like, how do you measure success? What are the qualities that you look for when you're hiring for someone in this business? And when you have a meeting and you've planned out those three A's,


and you're organized and structured, not only is it going to go well, they're going to be so impressed that you came prepared, presented yourself, and there's no job opening right now, well guess who the first person they're going to call when there is an opening? Because it's the hidden job market. There's thousands and thousands of jobs that never get posted. I just hired somebody from my company. I didn't put it on LinkedIn or Indeed. I don't have time for that as a business owner. I reached out to my network.


Farrell Sports Business (25:53)

You


Beth Hendler Grunt (26:00)

of saying, is what I'm looking for, does anyone know anyone? And sure enough, someone said, you know what, know a couple of people and I just brought somebody on and it was never out in the universe, no one knew it was there.


Farrell Sports Business (26:11)

I mean, I'm just only laughing because I'm the exact same. I live in Colorado Springs, University of Colorado, Colorado Springs is here. I love their students, hire them all the time and they'll do a career fair and they'll come up and they'll so when are you going to post your internship? I said, I'm not. And I'm actually interviewing right there and who has time to... It's sad, but it's true and it's just the way it works.


Beth Hendler Grunt (26:15)

Yeah. Yep.


Yeah. Yeah.


Farrell Sports Business (26:42)

Okay, I have to ask you about TikTok. You're, you know, I think we, it's also fair to say we both came to TikTok later in life, later in professional career. What do you, what do you, what do you like about it? How does it fit into your business? And just would love your take.


Beth Hendler Grunt (26:45)

Okay.


Mm-hmm. Yes.


Yeah, so TikTok, so I'm on every social channel and I've been pretty, I guess coming from a tech background, I feel like I'm pretty technically savvy. I shared early on, I always hire interns, they're usually college age and I had an intern who said, you know, you should really try TikTok and she was the one who started to teach me how to use it.


And we had one or two videos that kind of hit. She kind of showed me how to use it. And then I had one video where I literally took a post-it note and I put it behind my camera and I showed people how I'd write notes on it. I'm like, this is the best hack for any kind of video interview. And that went viral, like 2 million views. I was like, wow, maybe I should do something with this. And then I started also following creators. So I'm always a person of, if I'm on a platform, I want to learn how to optimize it. So I follow a lot of people.


who teach you how to kind of create your content. So when you do that, you need to, you know, people comment, you need to comment back, you need to make sure if they've asked a question, you do it with a video response, becomes another video. So I just started learning how to do it. And it's kind of been an interesting, sometimes fun thing, sometimes very frustrating because like everything else, TikTok is also a business and it needs to make money, right? It doesn't make money from...


me per se, you know, gives me a little incentive with the creator fund. It's barely any money, you know, so it incents people to create more content. But of course, their big moneymaker is through ads and advertising and now TikTok shop. So where I'm at conflict with TikTok is that I'm not going to represent something for TikTok shop. That's not my business. I have my own services. We're very professional, high level kind of concierge type support. So I'm not going to, like, as I said earlier, I'm not going to, you know,


sell like a pen or a portfolio. That's not how I represent it. I'm here to add value. And if I'm able to add value and you think you want to learn more and come to one of our webinars or go to my website, like that's, you know, what I'm going. So to me, but every channel is different. So if I create a piece of content for TikTok, it has to be different than what I create for Instagram and what I create for LinkedIn. And so it's, it's time, you know, it's all, it's all as I say, it's just like, you have to feed the monster cause it keeps wanting something different and algorithm. So


Farrell Sports Business (28:54)

You


It's.


Beth Hendler Grunt (29:21)

I try to keep up with all of it, but I don't let it run my life. I have a business to run. I'm a CEO of business that has hundreds of clients and many coaches and teams and parents and families. And I have to, you know, balance that within. So it's always a balance. Sometimes I feel like I got to get into it and do it more. And sometimes like, I just don't have time and it is what it is.


Farrell Sports Business (29:43)

I love it. Tick-tock is a, is a life suck. I, you know, I did, I started it as a lark and then thought it was going to give me some credibility at the dinner table with my, you know, then 20 something daughters. And it's just an eye roller now for them. But, so I'm going to put like links to your site and handles in the, in the show notes, but I can't imagine.


Beth Hendler Grunt (29:48)

Yeah.


you


Yeah.


Farrell Sports Business (30:12)

you know, people listening to this, especially if they're in this situation of student or parent that would want to investigate you and your services. What, what, what should people do? It's kind of a shameless plug opportunity, Beth, for next great step.


Beth Hendler Grunt (30:26)

Sure, sure. So there's two ways. So if you want to learn more, we'd love the opportunity to speak with you via a complimentary consultation. There's no pressure, no fee. On the top of my website, it's www.nextgreatstep.com. There's a button that says, Let's Talk, and either we can talk to you as a parent, a student, we can talk to you both together. If you're interested in learning more about how to navigate landing the internship or the first job.


The other way that you can learn more is you can get our Amazon number one bestselling book, The Next Great Step, The Parents Guide to Launching Your New Grad Into a Career. Even though it says parents guide, it's really for parents and also to work with their young adult. We are actually sharing two parts to it as we talk about the perspective of what parents thought would happen, what students thought would happen, and what employers are expecting in terms of the job search. And then we actually share our step-by-step approach.


So if you are a parent or a mentor or family member and you wanna work with a young adult in your life to help them navigate this process, we are laying that out in our book as well. And you can get that on Amazon. And as Matt said, we are on every social channel. We do a lot, and we also have a YouTube channel as well. We've been on NBC and Wall Street Journal, New York Times. anything next great step, you can check us out.


I try to keep very consistent about our messaging and what we can offer and really offering value to families.


Farrell Sports Business (31:57)

it's incredible conversation and long overdue for us to lead virtually face to face, but, Beth, I love what you're doing and love your tech talks. And so thanks so much for joining. really appreciate it.


Beth Hendler Grunt (32:11)

Thank you, I appreciate it.

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